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a talk underground
May. 23rd, 2015 10:50 pmSESSION PARTICIPANTS
KNIFE 
RAZOR 
MULBERRY 
SUGAR 
ALGORITH 
CANNON 
OVERLOAD 
JEMMA 
CHOCOLOCO 
JEWEL(post-entry note from Jay: I'm uploading this three days later but no one labeled their speech well so I apologize profusely if any sentences are misattributed. I've done the absolute best I can with this.)
All right. Oh, is it recording? I'm sorry, I didn't know it--
…
I have no idea how to do this.
The AP is getting confused. Give it time to record what we're saying first.
Are there mistranslation issues?
Always. It can only do so much, translating from thought speech into words. Written words.
Hm. Well, it is worth the effort, to see if we can do this alone.
Didn’t you say you wanted music on?
To appease the creative ones, yes. They're rather impatient that we're doing this instead of writing music anyway.
I can wait, you guys give it a try. Just don't stay up ALL night I guess.
That's what I want to start at. I have emotional investment in this. WHY is--
Why what?
Why are so many fronters depressed about dealing with headspace? I mean, like that one, the young ones..
They don't want to be depressed. Their role is separate than ours. So, they get depressed when we show up because they don't want to be involved in this stuff. Simple as that.
You're the protector of innocence, you should know.
That's why. I should know. And I do. If there's one thing I've noticed about the kids in the System, on the outside that is, it's that they don't want to lose their innocence "again." So she's impatient with us because she doesn't want… it's not that she doesn't want us to exist, I don't think. It's more like… she doesn't want the reason we exist to exist.
We come out for a reason, and she doesn't want to think about that.
Right. Thanks.
Not a problem.
So… Cannon?
Hmh?
Did you… you said you had an investment in this.
Music.
Oh, that's right, sorry. Can we pause this?
Momentarily, sure. Should we get Jewel to do that?
No, don't get her involved in this.
I think she's hanging around anyway.
Is she? Jewel, are we getting in your way?
No, it's just surreal to see this typing up on my screen! I wanna write stuff and I've got LOT of League things to do as always but this is cool too. Just you're right. I get kind of miffed about the whole "upstairs" thing because it's so moody.
That's what I want to talk about. The "moodiness." There's a REASON why we're so "moody" and it's not a good one. But it's a reasonable one.
Still, I wanna live without it. So don't take long.
"Kid," we've got to take as long as we need to, if we don't deal with this it won't go away.
Are you absolutely sure? I mean I'M fine.
Sure you're fine, you're a kid. The kids weren't allowed to be touched.
…Are you sure you're Cannon?
I'm an older Cannon. It's been a while since I was out, you know. 2009. I've changed since then, I had time enough to dissolve and die and whatever else happened to me. Now I'm rooted inside and life is different, you know? So I'm different.
You tried to kill us. You DID kill us.
Yeah, I'm really ticked off about that by the way.
I got off scot-free. No hard feelings.
Algorith.
Just joking around, Sugar. I don't got no hard feelings personally. But the whole thing is a blur.
Everything is a blur, is anyone else ticked off about that too?
Yes.
I'm profoundly worried about it.
Where's Razor?
Over there.
Jewel, why are you asking about Razor?
She's cool. I mean I know about you guys and she strikes me as pretty cool, I dunno. I guess I've got a fondness for creatures like her.
Edgy?
Psycho?
She's not 'psycho,' Algorith, that’s the concern we're having today actually. Razor, are you all right?
They ruined my knives. They ruined my razors. They're not holy anymore.
Since when did you care about your weapons being 'holy?'
Since always. Since I knew what they were. Atonement. Not you.
Excuse me?
Sugar, don't slip.
You're not an Atoner. You joined us later. You showed up to kill the bad ones. The hackers. I didn't.
You showed up rather differently, Razor.
I wasn't myself then, you know. All I know is this. The cutting things. And they ruined them.
They did not. They cannot change this for you.
…But they make it hard. They make it so it's not happy anymore. It's not art. It's 'business.'
…Sorry.
For slipping?
Yeah. I guess I'm still unstable on the inside.
You've always been unstable, Sugar, that I have realized. I can't help but feel it's related to your anchor.
Yeah, can we talk about that at long last? We're in here for a reason. The hackers are screwing things up. They're ruining atonement, they're not apologizing for their actions--
Hackers never apologize.
I mean they're not feeling sorry for what they've done.
Did they ever?
Geez, just-- just listen. Hackers. The NEW kind. They're not apologizing for what they're doing to the body when it's OUR body, and they KNOW it, don't they?
…Is that the question?
Is it?
What about Jemma? You brought the girl in here, she hasn't said a word.
She's quiet. I don't think she's used to operating on the inside yet either. At least, without her daemon around.
Yeaaah, don't bring him in here.
I don't have the right to.
There's a really massive brain fog around you guys, just saying.
I've noticed. It's making conversation rather difficult.
Is that just because of time gaps, or do we not have enough of a presence in here to talk yet?
Could be people blocking us out.
Hence the topic for the night. Hackers and their indifference towards everyone else in the System.
"Else?" Mul, I don't think anyone here considers them part of the System.
True, that is true.
…
So. Tonight. Let's just… take this slow. I'm not used to this A.P. thing either, that's confusing.
Yes, it is.
So hackers. Jemma decided to atone tonight because no one's been doing so and she wouldn't stand for it?
I had to push through apathy to do it. No one cares.
WE care.
No one in the body cares obviously. They said my emotions were fake. I was upset and I was sad too, but they said that there wasn't a problem? Without saying anything. It's more of a… a thick white distance. You know the, Knife you saw the fake snow that's around at Christmas?
Yes.
It's like that. Big, thick white gauzy blocks between me and them. Between my emotions and their feeling them. Or the body feeling them. I don't know. They just won't let me feel anything, there's this unspoken conviction or belief in them that "they're doing nothing wrong."
That is a LIE.
I know, but that's the problem. They DON’T care.
Do they feel nothing?
They do. I just…
They feel no guilt.
Jessica earlier labeled herself a "psychopath" with pride. She feels no regret, no empathy, and she's rather smug about it. That shows you what sort of people we're dealing with, Knife.
…But the children.
…
They're hurting the children.
Are they?
Aren't they? The children get the aftereffects of this, don't they? Unless Jeremiah…
I think they shut off the whole thing. They didn't want to be caught anymore so they shut off the whole entire thing, no one gets aftereffects at all because they "cancelled" those or something.
How do you know all this?
I'm tied to this. I'm a previous Host, or what you call it. I'm the most strongly tied to this sort of direct abuse because I was alive when this hell started being "justified" on the outside. So seeing that hell on the INSIDE is really getting me mad.
It would.
Yeah, it is. And I'm upset, too, because I don't know what to do about it.
I'm depressed.
We all are.
That's making it hard to fight back.
That might be part of the fog.
Probably. Fog is numbness, and that sounds like that's what we're dealing with.
Why don't they realize the harm of their actions?
Because to them there IS no harm. "It's not hurting anyone!" That's the Tumblr idiocy we internalized and it's why I'm one of the ones that hate that website. All these hedonistic teenyboppers running around acting like anything that "feels good" IS good. And we internalized that stupid mindset EVEN IF it wasn't true for us. Because we "had to."
That's a big topic slated for discussion, by the way.
Which one?
The internalization, and how that deals with alters, or headvoices. Survival and logic. We're born in order to protect our life in some way, so in some cases, 'evil' alters are created because they, for whatever reason, offer the most chance of 'survival' in that situation.
That's messed up.
I know it is, but it appears to be what's happening.
So we've got abusive alters because the System decided that THEY'D keep us alive??
Think about it, Sugar. If you have an alter who is incapable of feeling guilt, or shame, or regret, then it prevents us from killing ourselves over every humiliating thing we suffer. I suppose after so long of being hacked, especially with this constant bombardment of messages saying "you must like this, you must want this, your soul requires it, the world demands it, you cannot run from it, running is wrong," et cetera. There are a bunch of conflicting mindsets about this.
What's conflicting?
Our mindsets versus theirs. We know what we need, what we really want, et cetera. The 'world' does not. Yet we're stuck living in it, outside at least, and that's where these hacker fronters are coming into being-- to survive.
That's suicide though!! What kind of survival is it if it's killing us inside??
It's not killing them, though. They don't care at all. That's the thing.
Rrrrrgh!
Sugar don't lose your hair.
I'm sorry I'm just-- my role's been such a mess since I showed up here because I don't know HOW to protect anyone.
You're protecting Laurie, aren't you?
No. …No, I… I don't know how. I'm scared.
Of what?
Of the things that go after her. They're pure Plague, Algorith. I'm close enough to the White. I don't want them eating me from the inside out, after I've seen what they've done to the Cores in the past.
Hosts. Cores now applies to the Jewel bloodline only, and they're rather impervious.
Well that's good. But I…
You're scared of being corrupted?
We all are, Algorith?
…I guess I can't blame you.
Aren't you?
Hey, I didn't die in the massacre, I figure Cannon had to have some reason for missing me.
I didn't find you.
Well, that's reason enough.
But you realize I was ONLY killing you people because at the time I was CONVINCED you were ALL unsalvageably corrupted by the Tar and the Plague, right? I saw what 'we' were going through at that time, and how NO ONE was doing anything about it, at least not in my eyes, and so I took matters into my own hands. I had had it. There was one too many hacks, and you just LET it happen, and I thought "to hell with all of it. Five years after I died and this is still happening. To hell with this, I'm ending it." So I tried.
Weren't you with Jessica, though? Isn't she a hacker?
Listen, I don't know what I was doing then, whoever she was she was hellbent on killing you too. I figured it was for the same reason.
Was it Jessica, though, or was it Jezebel?
Probably Jezebel. Jessica doesn't exist on the inside.
Well there you have it.
Still.
Still what?
Still I can't believe this is still happening. The hacks.
Well now we know why. People don't care.
Hi Overload.
Hi.
You just stopping by or are you sticking around?
Either. This stuff is getting overwhelming anyway so it doesn't matter.
Is it?
Listen, what did we come in here to discuss tonight? Let's stop rambling and type about it.
The hackers. There are people who don't care.
Jasmine.
Yes. And Jessica, maybe.
And "the pagan," whoever she is.
That's Jasmine.
Is it?
Yeah. She got her name over the past week.
Is Jennifer a hacker?
No. But she paves the way for them.
…
Hey-- I thought I told you not to bring him in here.
I didn't. He just hangs around me.
Listen it doesn't matter if Chocoloco's around or not, he won't harm anyone.
It's not that, he feels scary.
Daemons do, from what I've heard.
You're unfazed by this?
Listen, I probably have a "daemon" myself, from what I've heard. I'm dark enough not to care. I've got enough edges to handle something like that in the room. Hackers. They aren't atoning and they don't care and they are now starting to justify their actions with such conviction that the subconscious is jumping on them.
What is their main conviction?
It's tied to the "logic" predisposition I mentioned earlier, Knife. At some point, the moral fear of being "unholy" trumped all sense of self-preservation.
Jessica doesn't seem to care a bit about being 'unholy,' she revels in it.
So I've noticed. But she isn't a sexual hacker, either. She's a body abuser, but that's it.
So Jasmine's the other sort?
Yes.
I'm gonna kill her.
Please do.
Not now, we need to discuss this.
I didn’t say I was going after her now, Knife. It's late and I'd have to find her. That sort of thing takes time.
I'll find her for you. Tomorrow, maybe.
There's a strong self-preservation drive around her.
What the hell?? I thought you just told me it doesn't care!!
It cares when it's "main fronter" is being threatened, the person who is currently ensuring that we "survive" according to what has been dictated as "correct behavior."
Man. …It's infuriating, all of it, it's nonsense.
…
So what do we do, Mulberry?
Honestly Knife I don't know. Reprogram the subconscious.
Which means…? What's the belief we need to program out?
That sex is mandatory for survival. This body is not only traumatized by it, but it does not want it by a biological standpoint either. Forgive me for this language, I'm sorry. But these fronters, they have apparently internalized the "spiritual messages" from outside that sex is an inherent quality of the spirit, and have mangled that thought to the point where they believe that if they DON'T have sex, then they are morally corrupt, and therefore not a true soul, et cetera.
What the hell.
It's complicated, I know.
Wasn't Jay working on this? Fixing it?
Jay is impervious to this, just as the Jewel Cores are. I've realized this.
So… do we let him out, or?
No. That fails to work, he gets switched out.
Oh come on.
I can try. From now on I can try, if they do.
Jemma we are not cut out for that sort of work. It is not our job.
Then whose is it, Chocoloco? If Jay and his daemon can't do it, if WE can't do it as retributors and atoners and mourners… then who can do it? Those hackers are blocking everyone.
…
I don't know.
Is this a problem we can even solve tonight?
Not in stream-of-consciousness mode we can't. Leave it to Jay and give him the data, see if he and Laurie can figure things out. He's got enough data to do it I'm sure.
I thought you said he switched out with this sort of thing.
Not if he's unattached to it. Only if he's in the body does he get switched out, he literally can't handle that or he dies, just like Laurie. He can handle this as a concept, he's completely detached from the side of this that we see.
So that's why they were hacking him so easily…
Hacking through him. Past him. Jay is untouched, that I see. He's pure, that's HIS function. Other ones aren't. There's the one that looks just like him and HE'S a whore at this point, he's someone we should watch out for.
He's all programming, I've heard?
You've heard of him?
I've seen him, firsthand. Remember when I first appeared here, "Jay" was the one I was atoning for. As it turns out there were many going by that name, then and now.
Which is why we're all looking for our own names lately, no exceptions.
Right. But back then… it was clear that there were more forces at work, when it was outlined to me. I'm sorry, it is terribly hard to talk in here.
Thank you, I was thinking the same thing.
Yeah, and you have a stronger anchor than all of us combined, probably.
Maybe, but you guys are all as real as me.
The fronters doubt it..
Tell them to bugger off.
Is that why we can't stop them either, Mulberry? They are outright rejecting our existence.
The hacker fronters call emotions "stupid" and they call us the same, yes.
All emotions except fake drama, that is.
They don't feel anything though. I can tell you that. It's just malice and pride.
So why are they doing this to us? To harm us?
Perhaps partly. These are more dangerous because their main motivation is blind obedience. It's hard to change a program when it's being reinforced by the outside, quite strongly.
Hm.
But we know better. That is our saving grace. WE know better. We just have to step back out front more often.
Good luck with that, it's easier said than done lately.
Better to have hope than to have nothing, though.
Eh, I guess you're right.
Knife should we write down the thing about the blood?
How do you know about the blood?
I'm looking at stuff. Trying to skim through your guys' memories and stuff to help you talk about it a little, if you need to. I can see stuff clearly a lot.
Is that why we can't talk in here? You're overshadowing us?
Maybe, sorry.
It probably is. Don't do that again, okay? This is difficult enough as it is.
Yeah but actually this is really impoirtant! I'M here and so are you!
…
You're right. That is significant.
So. Although I'm on the outside and you're on the inside this is still working. Which is really cool. And I'm looking at your memory like a movie and Knife was trying to drink the blood out of the washcloth but he had to spit it out because it tasted wrong or something.
I realized it was truly not meant to be eaten. It was bled out for a reason.
Why do you do the eating-blood thing anyway?
It is a symbolic thing, I suppose? Jay feels like he should have insight into it, he is very closely tied to this sot of sentiment…
Jay "feels?"
Jay is always around for us, all of us. He's the White core so his consciousness is tied to us all, even if he isn't around physically.
Is it easier for him to exist that way then?
Perhaps?
Probably, from what it says here.
Mulberry, you got the books?
Some books! Just a few. Enough to help. But Jay is notoriously noncorporeal whenever he gets the chance. It's easier for him to exist that way, yes.
Huh.
And I am aware that this 'ingestion' topic, especially of blood, has been rolling around in the collective mind lately. Jay is working on this topic and that data is accessible to me, to any of us really, as we are involved in this same agenda.
The atonement?
Retribution, yes, atonement, all of it. Jay carries aspects of it that none of us do.
Jay carries aspects of it that aren't quite "atonement," if you know what I mean. He stays innocent so he doesn't get 'punished.' But he carries the blood in his own way. So did I.
You carried the graves, didn't you? I heard of those.
Yes. All 42 of them, we counted. I've still got them. It's surreal.
…
Guys, perhaps we should close this up.
Already?
We aren't quite getting anywhere, are we? There is too much to discuss and we're rather unorganized for any conversation to happen.
That is true…
I am sorry. I insisted on a conversation and I wasn't quite sure what would happen, or if we would be able to have one at all.
No, it's all right, I'm glad we gave this a shot.
So am I.
Jemma, you didn't say much, and you're probably the main reason we're in here.
I know. I'm just sad and upset, it feels like talking won't do much to solve it. I think Mulberry Delta's right; we should just pass this information along to someone who can do something about it. Work through it.
Yeah, Central handles this better than we do…
We are not cut out for the complicated reasoning, as it were. Our job is rather… cut-and-dry.
He he he.
Haha, good one.
I was hoping that would get a laugh out of her.
Thank you Knife.
You're welcome, Razor.
Welp, I think that's about it then.
Who are you to say when we're done??
It feels done. I'll give this to Jay, tell him about it. Main concerns are the moral-less hackers, the subconscious 'logic' beliefs keeping them out, Mulberry?
Yes.
Okay, uh… basically figure out WHO is doing this stuff to you guys, WHY they're being ALLOWED to do that, even if it's a purely subconscious allowance, what with the logic things and all that… uh, figure out WHY they believe what they're doing is okay?
Well we know that, and it's not so much an "it's okay" thing so much as it's just a programming thing.
What's the difference?
Programming is deaf and dumb really. It doesn't care at all, for good or ill. It just… does things. It follows the script. If the script says kill someone, if the script says screw up someone's life big-time, they'll do it, without any remorse or second-guessing OR enjoyment, or guilt either, because "it's in the script! It's what I was told to do."
That's a very worrisome mindset.
It is. But I've been dealing with this mess with college, and you all have since you showed up too, I can see. It's all people saying "this is normal!" when even if it IS, it SHOULDN'T BE. And that's the core of the problem, right Overload?
I'm only in here because the stuff that they're doing to you causes the stuff that triggers ME. I really freaking hate it, and if there's anything I can do to stop them doing that stuff, then I will.
I daresay we all know your triggers?
Look in your book, they're in there probably. Noises, feelings, overload. Sensory hell. And SO MUCH of it is tied to YOU guys and your battles. It gets WORSE after hacks, so much worse I want to actually freaking DIE.
…
So yeah, I wanna help if I can. Just to get this freaking horrible stress to stop, if nothing else.
Thank you. I appreciate that well enough.
Good. Now I'm outta here 'cause like Jewel said, it feels like we're done and besides this robe feels horrible and I think we just need to dissociate and calm down for a while. See ya.
I don't know if 'dissociating' is key here?
Probably 'unplugging' from the stress is, if that's what they call it. Hence the music?
I am so sorry, I never put it on…
That's fine, I think this worked out well enough anyways.
It did. So! We're done here? Any last words or whatever? Jemma?
What?
You got us in here, you stood up to someone and got atonement happening. You tried to feel something in the face of those bastards. I'm proud of you for that, for what it's worth. There's too few people up here who can still do that, I think.
Like you?
Like always me. I was born from rage about this. I'm not gonna lose it. Sugar you might be sharing my anchor, maybe that's why you're slipping?
No, I'm more of a Protector. Of the innocent. The untouched.
Have you been doing that though?
…
Sorry, I don't mean to condemn you or anything, I'm just saying maybe you should do that more actively for it to switch over? Otherwise we're just sharing the same job and no offense, but I think I have more weight in this than you. Seniority. Sorry.
No, don't apologize, that's a good idea. …I'm sure there are untouched ones in here.
Man, that's sad.
There's always Laurie. She needs protection more than any of us, I daresay.
Laurie?
She's our Chastity Protector.
I've seen how Jay panics whenever she shows the slightest hint of weakness or hesitation. Confusion, especially. She's as fragile as he is, in her own way. The strong ones always are.
An oxymoron, Knife?
Not quite. It seems the ones like her and Jay are especially targeted by the Tar and Plague. They're fragile because they are so strong, they… they doubt themselves.
Sounds like they need a different kind of strength.
Additional strength. Yes.
Do you have a headache, man?
Yes, and I apologize. Mulberry, do close this up. I feel we have talked enough and I do not want to end this on a negative note.
Yeah, you look stressed as hell.
Aha, I am sorry. It is just… overwhelming.
That's what I said!
Where is she?
Hell if I know.
Somewhere we should be. Cannon, can you close this?
Me? Why?
Because you have the most say in this. As a previous Core. Host.
Both, in my time. And sure I'll close it up. Jewel are you around?
…Did she actually leave?
Maybe that's where the headache's coming from, man, it all went to you.
Why me? I don't have the must pull in this.
Maybe you do. Leader of the Retributors and all.
…
Really Knife, you're too humble. I'll close this up for you. But it's going to take a bit before that stress goes away if I remember it right.
I'll be fine. Don't worry about me.
Yeah but your sister's already worrying.
Is she?
…What did you do to him?
Nothing, nothing Razor. It's just stress.
Close this up.
Well, there's the final say.
About time though.
Isn't that a thing for Xangas?
Must be an initiation process.
You seem a little lighter than you were when we first got in here, Cannon.
I feel a LOT lighter. It's just… nice to be alive again. To feel alive, really.
…The fog's lifting, Cannon.
Yeah, well, too late now. Oh. Wait, that's why?
What?
I'm splinching with Hatchet.
You're what?
Co-fronting. They're bleeding into each other. The body must be trying to get another social fronter out to-- oh, there goes our link.
All right, last semi-coherent sentence, everyone follow up on this, Jewel do what you said you would, if I have closing rights for this then close this now. Thank you.
12:11 AM may 24th 2015
Tags:
- 2015,
- atonement,
- author:algorith,
- author:cannon,
- author:chocoloco,
- author:jemma,
- author:jewel,
- author:knife,
- author:mulberry,
- author:overload,
- author:razor,
- author:sugar,
- entries to review,
- hacks,
- hatchet,
- important entries,
- important info,
- jasmine,
- jessica,
- laurie,
- milestone entries,
- mood: lost,
- multiple authors,
- protectors,
- retributors,
- the massacre,
- trauma talk,
- undergrounders,
- xanga
